Track Day Alternative

[alexwebster]

DECA

Okay it seems I have sparked quite a little thread here!!

I think from what has been said, that DECA could be a great alternative to high speed, high braking speed tracks such as Winton or Calder (in VIC! sorry JR). As a young kid of about 15 I was allowed to drive at DECA (Thanks CAMS!) and get to know what a 356 drove like on a skid pan, on a track and the figure 8's. Needless to say this allowed me to drive a car a lot earlier than most, let alone a rear engined car, and work out what the hell happens!!!! For me, like many it is second nature now.

DECA has the skid pan which I think is a must, and great for competitive people, and while it does not give high speed stuff, does give us all a feel of what happens in the wet and when pushed too hard, even at low speed.

The figure 8's are probably a waste of time, but again will show things such as suspension set up... get the video out and see the pitch on some of the cars!!

The track is quick enough to get some speed up can be slowed by using chicanes of witches hats so that terminal speed is lowered until drivers are comfortable. Furthermore only one or two cars can really be on that track at once, as it is not easy to pass on!

I don't know the cost, but I am sure that being at DECA insurance would be include to some degree, and disclaimers signed...

Either that, or all 901'ers get to a John Bowe drive day and get some high performance driving education. Word of warning though, you will chew tyres, and some brakes, but overall you can have fun in your normal 901.

These cars are not easy to drive on the limit, and I by no means claim to be an expert by an stretch of the imagination. But I think that DECA as an INITIAL speed/education/competitive event may be a good alternative... and we could make a weekend out of it?!

Okay - let the conversation continue!

[Porsche]

For a complete track virgin like myself, please advise what I have to do in terms of requirements, for myself and my car?

[Marcus]

Hi Guys,

The important thing here is that we are not at the risk of turning into a competition oriented club as we have seen the detrimental effects this can have.

I like the idea of a simple track day (especially tagging onto someone elses as all the hard work has been done) and clubs like AROCA & BMW do run a great day. They also offer a nuns and novices familirisation session with experienced club members as passengers to ease people in and to help them prepare for the onset of the red mist! AROCA also put novices in a group of their own (and arrange other cars according to lap times) to stop the horrible being overtaken at twice your speed feeling!

I would agree that a simple driver training day prior to this would also be a good idea - perhaps an alternative to our own day is to have a group attend a murcott (or similar) school session?

Also, we could do a Winton private practice day (about $100 each car from memory) they run these on selected Fridays and it is a good opportunity to get some seat time.

The one thing that we need to re-enforce for track day first timers is KNOW YOUR LIMITS BY BUILDING UP SLOWLY.

If we couple this advice with a strict policy of coming down hard on unsafe driving then (in my experience) we should have a good event.

Best Wishes
Marcus

[lisa_spyder]

Guys....

Alex, we've looked at DECA Shepparton as it is the obvious choice but it is way too expensive for our small group. We have also looked at the other DECA facilities and have discounted one as not being suitable and think the other at Newhaven is still too costly for the benefits that can be achieved.

Marcus, I'm not fond of the private practice idea at either Winton on a Friday or Calder on a Wednesday arvo because you are never sure what will be there and who. OK for the guys who have already done some track time, but a novice is going to find it very tough when a Formula Ford catches them at the speed of light and passes under brakes before they even see him! Too many variables as both these venues open to pretty much anyone for PP and you can't really pick and choose who you run with as a lot of guys treat these sessions as shakedowns or set-ups for their cars and won't stay off the track for others as they are running to a schedule.


AROCA and FFCC do great driver training sessions through the year. Ford Four (FFCC) often run a weekend meet at Winton; Saturday all day is driver training and Sunday is sprint day. These are great value weekends but I still think that for some of the guys to dip their toes in the water correctly we need to run a really basic, low speed day about car and driver control. You don't need to be travelling at terminal speed to test ability :wink: or to sort out any shortcomings in the car either.

We are looking at Heathcote Park Dragway as a lot of driver ed stuff goes on up there as it is very wide and is from memory a standing kilometre plus run off. Also checking with Mangalore Airstrip for the same reasons. Both facilities appear to be reasonable for hire fees but we're waiting on more info. We were thinking of conducting a theory session firstly, complete with running through the safety requirements and how to check and prepare one's car before a sprint. Then we thought a day of witches hats (not bloody motorkhanas!) and wet course stuff with maybe a fun rolling start drag for kicks complete with Christmas tree operational if at Heathcote would be the right idea for the newbies among us to test themselves and learn from others whilst having fun in a safe environment. This way we have really started at introductory level, including a bit of marshalling info as well as a lot of clubs rely on the competitors to do a stint through the day as marshalls.

How does this sound to you guys? I know it appears to be very basic, but I think we can tailor this sort of day to the entrants we have and endeavour to cater to everyone as best as possible.

[JD]

I think your suggestions are right on Lisa

I agree with your assessment of the private runs given my experience at Calder. Also the idea of testing the cars handling without testing the body strength due to other unfortunate objects coming in contact with the car as good too. Witches hats sound great, even if we hit a few :mrgreen:

[mj911e]

as an absolute track virgin, I think your ideas Lisa (et al) sound great, I can't wait..

[e72phil]

Track day Virgins

All track day Virgins, please ask Santa for a helmet for Christmas. it will be one of the first things you need and usually a fire extinguisher too (with a good floor bracket to hold it firmly in place).

And if you feel you will be then venturing off into other events like tarmac rallies etc, make sure its got all the correct approvals. the retailer usually can advise about which standards and certification is required for a helmet.

Sounds like we have hit a nerve here as well with a few guys wanting to take the toys out t really play with them.

I would second Marcus's comments about advanced driving courses and training sessions at club track days. the open sessions at Calder and Winton could also be possibilities but you take pot luck who else is out on the track at the same time. Not necessarily a good idea if you have never driven a track before and are still learning what the racing line means.

[Porsche]

Yeah, I'm not interested in competing, I just want to get to know the limits of my car.

[spydr32000]

I really do think there is NO WAY, any one of our members who have not ventured out on to a race track previously should have any exposure to these practice days! As has been said previously you could very easily find your self being mixed in with a huge variety of people and cars. I have had days out at Calder and Winton where there have been everything from V8 supercars, Formula Fords, Go Karts, Super Bikes, Sports Sedans, everything. All these cars and bikes have a huge variety of drivers/riders with a variety of experience and attitude.

The closing speed is such, that you might think your watching your mirrors, but you WILL NOT realize how fast these things catch you. Some of our guys think they are fast, let me tell you, at best, they are only quick, not fast! As an example any one of our cars could be crossing the start/finish line at Calder with the next car coming onto the straight, by the time you have reached the braking area you have already been passed and the other car would have already disappeared. This is just an example, it might sound a bit like a fantasy but it is fact!

I have had many years of racing experience and being involved with CAMS Licence evaluating for 14 years. These days I even get a bit spooked in this sort of traffic, for the first few laps until I settle into again. I do not have the opportunity to spend as much time on circuits as I used to any more, which is why it takes a few laps to settle in.

[Chuck Miller]

I couldn't agree more with Mike and Lisa …

Walk before you run … in a safe controlled environment… with instruction from someone who REALLY knows the ropes…

I have witnessed 'drivers' who have been so scared by their first irresponsibly run track experience that they never drove on a track again… EVER

Or … Drivers that have been non-instructed or ill-instructed that acquired bad performance driving habits that took years to correct…

… and the list goes on

Every one of these wonderful old cars we drive has MUCH more potential then the novice driver can even imagine… the path to that potential is a VERY satisfying one … take your time ... 8)

Cheers mates

[e72phil]

Hey Chuck, we need some good instructors down here. grab your helmet and come on down !

best wishes to you for the Festive season.

Enjoy the New Years day run. Gotta go on one of those one day !

[Porsche]

In terms of track/auto-X etc - I think I'll have to learn to crawl before I even walk, let alone run. I look forward to learning from the masters.

[JD]

I have witnessed 'drivers' who have been so scared by their first irresponsibly run track experience that they never drove on a track again… EVER

Ahem....:wink: , not irresponsible run track but 3 therapy sessions later and maybe I will get rid of the shakes. Given my fragile state, all I need is:
1. the promise of no Formula Fords on the track
2. No 928s with broken coolant hoses
3. a better attitude
4. good company ~ not to say Mike wasn't great last time

witches hat are my friend

I think I swore after last time that I would never go on a track again. But that can change. Calder was my first experience and it was a complete eye opener for a novice like myself. I was first amazed at how small the track felt and how close the concrete walls seemed. Also, that formula ford car or whatever it was was so low down you couldn't see it coming. I think, stupidly, I spent much of my time looking in my rear view mirror and watching out for Porsches that were less than ten years old and had roll cages in them, and less on the track in front of me. I was also hopeless on the track as my mastery of the 901 gearbox was a joke (when under pressure). Basically I sucked. It was only with the excellent tutelage under Mike did I stay in one piece.

And then the creme on top was riding shotgun with Mark Johnson and hitting radiator coolant, fishtailing, and noticing a 944 on the side of the track with its rear end all bashed in and the driver just staring blankly into nothing as a steamy, smoky haze surrounded his crushed shell of a car. If it had been me driving the 911 I shiver to think where the car would have gone when it hit the coolant.

Anyway, that's all history now

[hippo]

I tend to agree with Lisa too. My track experience is limited to bikes..mainly Pi and Eastern Creek...even then I get monstered by anthing remotely track based...so I certainly would like my first car track experience to be more about challenging fun than a towie to Mike Tankard !!

Would also be good to get a reasonable notice for us adventerous Sydneysiders to get the weekend leave pass...I hope my wife doesnt figure out how to access this site yet !!

[Chuck Miller]

OK mates… this is coming from a guy who 'time trials' not races like Mike J. and some of the others on this board…
BTW - The difference is like hitting a tennis ball against a back board by yourself, and playing against an opponent.
Anyway, I've been time trialing on the track for quite some time and have instructed a bit and this is some of what I've learned…

- Performance driving comes more naturally to some then others… but almost all can learn.
- You don't have to be a 'gear-head', mechanic, or even a car guy to learn to drive a car fast… but having 'sympathy' with the car REALLY helps…. Through the years I've met guys and gals who had trouble tying their shoes, that have eventually become GREAT racers… amazingly.
- Novices should not be reluctant or ashamed to ask even the most fundamental and basic questions.

- You should start with the basics:
- You should first be shown or learn the best diving position to have the BEST arm/leg leverage, best view, and most comfort going fast …. Most want to sit MUCH further back then best suited for fast driving… Novices tend to get a little nervous and pull their backs off the seat as their speed increases anyway…If you're seat is already a little closer to the wheel in the first place you have no place to go but back in the seat and then relax again.
- You should learn and then practice a basic 'skill set' of 'going', 'stopping', 'turning' and 'shifting'…. These skills can be practiced on the street with ANY vehicle. ANY TIME YOU DRIVE ANYTHING you practice the basic skills… Make every acceleration off a stoplight the smoothest and very best you've ever done… every stop the smoothest and most controlled… every turn the most precise and planned you've ever done….. And every shift , the smoothest and best you've ever made… every time you drive. Two things start to happen, one it's a bit more fun then just spacing out driving on the street… and second, you start acquiring a 'sense memory' in your body and bones, that will take over just like when the kid jumps out in front of you… you don't think, you just do.. Same thing with the basic skills… the best every time… over an over.
- Part of your basic skill set should be knowing how to 'match rev' the engine to the desired down shift, so the engine speed will match the chosen lower gear selection……Again, this is for smoothness and drive train longevity... This involves all three pedals and (for most) just two feet… hence the term 'Heel'n Toe' … also both hands … and, after awhile, hopefully not much thought.
There's been whole chapters on this technique ……… learn it, use it … every time, everywhere… and eventually it'll become second nature…. And part of the skills you don't have to think about.

- When'ya finally get to the track, I usually suggest that a new driver drive around a little with his helmet on … this is usually the first time people drive with their shinny new, or beat-up borrowed helmets… If their newly learned (or not so new) driving skills had to do with the sound of the engine, like most of us, then all of a sudden you have MUCH less of an auditory 'cue' then before… another thing to get used to.

- When you get an instructor you should be able to communicate with each other easily … not only the ability to hear one another, but to disseminate information easily and quickly… It's nice to get along. This is important and serious stuff… if you ain't getting it, or if they're not teaching it so you can understand it… switch instructors… it's safer and saves time.

- Look WAY ahead on the track … get the BIG picture… anticipate… or, as they say in go karting, STOP looking at your shoes!!!

- And last for now..
Get help from those who you KNOW can do it RIGHT… not from those who THINK they can...


Uh Oh … Holiday breakfast is over here at the Mouse… back to work

Hope any of this helps,

Holiday Cheers,